The_800_Pound_Gorilla_In_The_Room <{}'; ~ ) >
2009-08-02 19:43:37 UTC
Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2008
Subject: Re: Michael Vick?Do you think he got what he deserved?
Or do you think he got off easy? lets start a debate...
HOWEDY joyorban,
"Pitbull Cruelty-Stop Animal Cruelty Please Read..."
<***@gmail.com> wrote in message news:15d94118-
af59-4bfe-8fd4-***@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
Permit me to introduce myself.
I'm The_800_Pound_Gorilla_In_The_Room <{}';~ ) >
I did *NOT* come here to ATTACK you <{}'; ~ ) >
CONtrary to pupular belief, Gorillas, are generally shy and
retiring; although I cannot speak for ALL Gorillas, we usually
prefer a veggie diet but some *(depending on their parenting)
will occasionally indulge in MEAT *(yuk!) and MOST of us
engage in frequent polygamous SEX **(Yummy~!).
I'll just gather some fresh soft leaves and make myself a nest
in the corner of your livin room here and you're welcome to
ignore me. I'll just keep quietly to myself <{}'; ~ ) >
Care for a bananna?
I just LOVE coconuts~! Don't you?
Hey?? Put two of them an WON of these banannas together
and you can PRETEND you're a Gorilla too! Hey lookey!
Squeeze this bananna an you get... hmm~!
fans, advertisement endorsements and millions an millions of
dollars?
What more would you PREFER to have done to him?
Would you cut his balls off like a ordinary dog lover does their own
dogs?
Google has 11,200 results for neutered in rec.pets.dogs.behavior
alone
and 397,000 for neutered in Google groups and 2,690,000 on the web.
Seems neutering is pretty well commonly accepted standard EXXXCELLENT
care and treatment of GOOD dogs <{}: ~ ( >
Wouldn't that be a REWARD?
Would you PREFER to jerk an choke him on a pronged spiked pinch
choke collar like a common dog in OBEDIENCE TRAININ?
LIKE THIS?:
"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss
http://tinyurl.com/5m6ppt
-----------------
Would you PREFER to whip him with a riding crop?
LIKE THIS?:
"Pudge Was So Soft That She Could And
Would Avoid A Simple Swat On The Rump
With A Riding Crop," lying frosty dahl,
discoverer of CANNIBALISM in Labradors.
--------------------
Would you lock him in a box for 16 - 20 hours a day and
jerk an choke him on a pronged spiked pinch choke collar
and spray aversives in his eyes?
LIKE THIS?:
From: BethF (***@alaska.com)
Subject: Re: to treat or not to treat
Date: 2002-01-14
I dont' jerk or choke my dog (the little one is
too little yet for a pinch collar). They simply
wear pinch collars.
It prevents any jerking or choking on their part.
I do crate my dogs - the big one only at the dog
club and to travel, and the little one so he can
become accustomed to being in a crate.
He is learning to enjoy it and to use it as a place
to rest from the playing that he and Kavik do
.
I used binaca to quiet Kavik's in class whining
that disturbed the class. It would be quite difficult
to binaca a dog that is in a crate.
I did hit him in the eye accidentally, and stopped
using it at that time. Jerry, have you NEVER made
an error in training the dogs you have trained?
How many dogs have you trained exactly?
Can you list some references here - I
would like to contact some of your former
clients to get a reference or two?
------------------
AND LIKE THIS?:
lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver:
For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and
pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to
it. When he barks, use the line for a correction.-
if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar," Lynn K.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"Unfortunately, some confrontation is necessary,
just to be able to handle the dogs. For example,
we need to crate train a dog immediately because
they are usually in need of medical care and they
are in foster homes with other dogs. It's a safety
necessity," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"So what? Whoever said that it's right to
always not confront? We sure can try, but
a dog who knows a command and growls when
given it is certainly being confrontational".
You can't simply walk away and pretend it
didn't happen or leave it for later work in
every situation." Lynn K.
-----------------------------
AND LIKE THIS?:
"Well, actually the binaca worked but after i
got him in the eye it was not a possibility to
be using that."
"Actually, the most common use of this technique
(and it is quite common) is with TABASCO sauce
either mixed with water in a spray bottle or on a rag
that you can stick in the dogs mouth instead of spraying
(after our experience I would suggest this method if I
was going to use this technique again). My dog likes
tabasco so that didnt' work for us.
Binaca was suggested as an alternative from a very
well respected dog trainer from the lower 48, however
I don't think she counted on his flailing his head in a
desperate attempt to get away from the sprayer causing
me to miss."
------------------
Would you PREFER to shock him till
you can see his neck muscles pulsing?
LIKE THIS?:
"J1Boss" <***@aol.com> wrote in message news:***@mb-m18.aol.com...
He was next to me and I could see his neck
muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.
Janet Boss
An INSENSITIVE DOG???
Do you think the citronella collar is CRUEL
cause the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's
been sprayed in the face and the dog won't
know HOWE COME IT was MACED?
They're DUMB ANIMALS these MENTALLY ILL LYING
DOG ABUSERS HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.
-----------------------
Would you PREFER to turn a Doberman loose on his stinkin arse?
LIKE THIS?:
"BethF" <***@alaska.com> wrote in message news:***@corp.supernews.com...
Maybe that's what we should do - hold back the dobie
girl so that Izzy can put Simon in his place.
--------------------
Would you STEP ON HIM like a common dog??
LIKE THIS?:
"BethF" <***@NOT-SO-bad-dawgs-in-ak.com>
wrote in message news:***@corp.supernews.com...
Kyle, FWIW, i thought it was pretty funny,
and i often call my little dog the turd, because
he is one. Some folks think its HORRRIBLE i
would insult my dog like that so i guess its just a
matter of personality.
Kyle, the best way to teach him to stay away is to
step on him once. Seriously.
--------------
Perhaps he'd think of all that as a REWARD an LOVE you for it?
LIKE THIS:
"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution Will
Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
AND LIKE THIS?:
Here's tommy sorenson of sorenson's Retriever PUPPY MILL
and SHOCK COLLAR trainin SALES aka the miserable stinkin
lyin animal murderin child an spHOWES abusin anonymHOWES
active accute chronic life long incurable mental case punk
thug coward aka not so handsome, not so gentle, not so
manly
jackass, not even jack morrison, aka joey finochiarrio aka
BIG
DADDY aka DOGMAN HEELPIN dogs:
tommy sez:
At no time do the Monks *ever* advocate beating a
dog. A swat on the rump or a check to the chin does
*not* constitute a "beating."
And then he sez:
"I don't know how big you are, kiddo, so this may
not be as easy for you as it is for me, but use
a little "knee action," that is, as the dog goes
charging by you, just give the dog a little bop
with your knee and shin. Yep, really lean into it.
Even knock her over, if you can, but make sure to
make her think twice about rushing past you again -
- which is exactly what you want her to do.
Don't bother with scolding her, she'll get the message.
If it happens again, just REPEAT the knee action.
When she steps on your toes, just pick up your foot
abruptly and nudge her with your knee. Again, no
scolding is necessary here, so you don't have to
worry about her "over-reacting."
I don't think this is necessarily a lack of respect
for you, just a lack of training. That is, she just
needs *more* of it."
You mean like HOWE when you HOWEsbreak a dog an
you beat IT with a switch or heavy man's leather belt and
tie him next to his evil deed and return to BEAT HIM every
twenty minutes, tommy?
tommy SEZ:
"My objective is always to find a way that WORKS.
And if it is DANGEROUS behavior that I'm trying
to modify, behavior than can get the dog KILLED,
I will resort to ANYTHING to save him.
A-N-Y-T-H-I-N-G.
Okay. Call me a cruel, inhumane, abusive bastard
if you want to, but it doesn't affect me at all.
When you've saved the lives of as many dogs as I
have, you'll learn that that's the only thing that
really matters. Saving lives and making dogs become
good citizens"
"Swatting a dog on the nose is always the wrong thing to do."
LIKE THIS:
"I used to work the Kill Room as a volunteer in
one shelter.) But their ability to set their own
schedules and duties causes a great deal of
scheduling overhead.
And it takes effort and thought to ensure that
volunteers get the meaningful experience that
they work for.
Someone has to be responsible for that
Volunteer Program, and it is best done
by a non-volunteer."
Lynn K.
----------------
"I worked with one shelter where I bathed and groomed
every adoptable dog on intake. I frankly felt that the
effort/benefit equation was not balanced for some of the
older/ill poodle/terrier mixes we got in badly matted condition.
Should I have refused to groom them?
Or even more pertinent - I was one of the people who
had to make the euthanasia decisions at that shelter."
Lynn K.
----------------
AND LIKE THIS?:
I'll be you've never had to put down litters of
beautiful labrador puppies? If you had did, maybe
you'd be singing a different tune?
"Actually, have held them for the tech to euth, and
put their bodies in the trash bag and in the freezer
for the trash company to come and dispose of.
No different tune," ~Emily
~emily is a vivisectionist for a med research laboratory.
------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
"After Numerous Training Classes, Behavioral
Consultations, And Hundreds Of Dollars In Vet
Bills, I Killed My Dalmatian Several Years Ago
Due To Extreme Dog-Aggressiveness," mustang sally.
"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me.
I volunteered as assistant to the euthanasia
tech at our local shelter for a while, and
I know a bit about overpopulation and unwanted
animals.
This however has nothing at all to do with
responsible breeders, because responsible
breeders don't contribute to that problem,"
Mustang Sally.
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001
Subject: Re: shock collars
Sally Hennessey <***@ncweb.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
Aside from being incredibly offensive and self-
righteous, this post shows and absence of knowledge
in the differences in dogs' temperaments, or perhaps
a lack of ability to perceive same.
The fact that you, Alison, have never met a dog to
whom corrections and discomfort, even pain, were
unimportant does not mean that such dogs do not exist.
What it means is that you don't know as much about
dogs as you think you do, and you surely don't know
a damn thing about Harlan or anyone else's dog here.
I had a Dalmatian that would instigate fights with
one of her housemates; that dog had no fear or
anything, and pain incurred during a fight meant
nothing to her.
I know that that dog is not unique, and I'm sure many
people here can tell similar stories. The fact that
you, Alison, continue to say things to people such as
what you said to Theresa about causing her dog to
suffer (at least I guess that's what you meant by
"you cause your dog suffers" - - must be the King's
English you guys talk about over there) means that
you are an ignorant, arrogant, insensitive person
who is not worth further notice.
Sally Hennessey
"Sally Hennessey" <***@ncweb.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
Nope. No more than you'd convince Patch that
prongs and e-collars, in the right hands, are not
intrinsically abusive; or that dogs trained properly
with prongs or e-collars are not fearful, in pain, or
intimidated; or that any one of us here knows our
own dogs and their reactions better than someone
who has never seen them or us...hmmm.
I'm starting to see some similarities here.
Sally Hennessey
---------------
Here's janet's PARTNER:
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context,"
No, there was ONLY WON quote.
Of curse. QUOTED. You wanna see it in context?
No. There was WON DIRECT QUOTE.
"Neatly," and "Smartly."
"sinofabitch" instead of sionnach.
INDEEDY. That's HOWE COME you deny it.
That so?
We'd been talkin abHOWET beatin the dog with a shoe...
The WON sinofabitch totally DENIES.
Only if you're a MENTAL CASE.
Here's Jerry's version
"I Dropped The Leash, Threw My
Right Arm Over The Lab's Shoulder,
Grabbed Her Opposite Foot With My
Left Hand, Rolled Her On Her Side,
Leaned On Her, Smartly Growled Into
Her Throat And Said "GRRRR!" And
Neatly Nipped Her Ear," sinofabitch.
Here's yours:
"I dropped the leash, threw my
right arm over the Lab's shoulder,
grabbed her opposite foot with my
left hand, rolled her on her side,
leaned on her, said "GRRRR!" and
nipped her ear.
--Sara Sionnach
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context"
See?
tommy will go first:
tommy wrote:
"This, from a yellow-bellied coward who has TOTALLY refused
to engage me in debate, preferring mudslinging, hyperbole,
distortion,
lies, exaggeration, and to take Koehler completely out of context,
instead," From: ***@i1.net (Dogman) Date: 1997/11/11
Subject: Re: Koehler's Usefulness--A Concluding Assessment
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
Let's DEBATE your OBEDIENCE TRAININ, eh, tommy?
We can recommend it for use on Michael Vick <{}: ~ ) >
LIKE THIS:
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * ***@lppi.ucsf.edu
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal sgt grant teebon, RAAF:
"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds
To Pain And Punishment, High Tolerance For
Correction, Escalation Of Correction To A Level
Where The Dog Yelps When You Punish Him,
Thus Making The Experience One Which The Dog
Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon,
RAAF.
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal captain
arthur haggerty, USArmy K-9 Corps:
captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK"
Makes A ResoundingSound Distraction: "When
You Chuck The Dog The Sound Will Travel Up
The Mandible To The Ears And Give A Popping
Sound To The Dog."
lying frosty dahl writes:
"Get a stick 30- or 40-inches long. You can have a
helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less
tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking
them more sharply.
With your hand on the collar and ear, say, 'fetch.'
Immediately tap the dog on the hindquarters with the
stick. Repeat "fetch" and pinch the ear all the way to
the dummy.
Repeat, varying how hard you hit the dog,
Now you are ready to progress to what most
people think of as force-fetching: the ear pinch.
Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent
that resisting your will fades in importance.
but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch
You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb;
even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that
Say "fetch" while pressing the dummy
against its lips and pinching its ear.
if the dog still does not open its mouth,
get out the shotshell.
Try pinching the ear between the metal casing
and the collar, even the buckle on the collar.
Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in"
==============
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER PAL an janet's
REAL LIFE IN PERSON "students" paul an Muttley:
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
Hello everyone:
If you have followed some of my posts, you know
something about the ongoing story of Muttley, the
large GSD/Chow dog I have been trying to adopt
or place in a better home.
I will add a bit more history later in this post.
Last Tuesday, toward the end of Janet's obedience
class, Muttley and I had just finished fairly successfully
performing a sit/stay/come routine, and then he was
sitting by my side.
The final routine was to be a "down", which Muttley
has had some difficulty with, and frankly I have not
had the time to work with him much on that.
I was kneeling at his side, trying to hold his collar
while pushing his front legs down to the position,
while he resisted. Suddenly he lunged, knocking
me over onto the parking lot, and I lost grip of the
leash as I reflexively broke my fall.
Muttley took the opportunity to attack a young black
male Lab to my left, and it was a very brutal attack.
Janet and the instructors tried to gain control, and as
soon as I could get to my feet I grabbed the leash and
pulled him off.
That was the end of the class, and the other dog,
Bernie, was taken to an animal hospital for treatment.
When everyone had left, Janet counseled me about
what should be done about Muttley.
She said this was more than ordinary aggression,
and only intensive (and expensive) one on one
training would have any chance at working, and
in any case, he was not suited to group training.
She advised me that Muttley could be dangerous,
and she recommended that he be euthanized.
"They can't all be saved".
<snip>
--------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
<snip>
If I did not have to worry about my cat, I would
probably keep him, and I am certain I could avoid
any more dangerous episodes. I probably would
not have taken him to obedience classes at this time
if that was not such a difficult issue, and if people
here had not essentially shamed me into doing so.
Then he would only be a bratty dog with a mind of
his own, but he would not have been identified as
dangerous.
--------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER PAL an janet's
REAL LIFE IN PERSON "student" paul:
#2 - 6/05/07
yanks on a chain choke collar. I hate the things.
confident trainer. Fear has no place in dog
training, as I told you THEN.
Janet
It seems to me that applying stern corrections, by
popping a choker chain, prong collar, or whatever,
is a way to ensure compliance by instilling a fear
of further punishment.
Sure, if it is administered very consistently
by a confident trainer, the dog soon learns
to obey. There was no positive reinforcement,
so what remains is negative.
Also, I recall the time you were going to show me
how I could get Muttley to take his rawhide treat
from me without lunging for it. When you offered
it to him, he refused to take it. This IMHO is likely
a fear behavior.
Things have changed a lot since then, and I have
learned a lot, and Muttley has settled down quite
a bit. I probably still give him too much freedom
to think on his own, but that's just my way of
doing things, and that's probably not going to
change much. He may never win an obedience
medal, but I don't think he is dangerously out
of control, either.
Paul and Muttley
----------------
"I thought I was told that the way to get the dog to go
down was to make him sit and then step on the leash.
That was awkward and didn't seem to work.
I will confess that I only tried the "down" position
once or twice at home, and I also often used it
instead of "Off" when I wanted him to stop
jumping on me or elsewhere I didn't want him to be.
I had to give him corrections every few seconds,
and also just about kick him, to keep him at my
left side.
Muttley is really a very sweet and loving dog, but
he needs more socialization with other dogs. However,
it is very likely that I will have him put down in a week."
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),
-----------------------
THAT'S quite a SUCCESS STORY, ain't it, paulie?
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
HERE'S HOWE COME:
Subject: Re: redirected aggression
Date: 4/11/07
"Janet Boss" <***@bestfriendsdogobedience.com> wrote in message news:janet-***@news.individual.net...
It seems I have been dealing with this a bit lately.
Dog to dog and dog to person,, with dogs who are
obviously overstimulated by what's in front of them.
What's in front of them varies from people at the door
to dogs in their path or directly in their face. The dogs
in question all have very poor self control.
I have dog(s) with not-so-great-natural self control,
so it's something we constantly work on. We don't
have redirected stuff going on, because we have enough
obedience to avoid it.
While I know that's the big answer for the dogs in
question as well, I'm curious what things people have
found useful to redirect/focus/gain attention from
drivey dogs or just very distracted of over-the-top dogs.
We're having success with my recommendations, but I'm
always open to something novel that may be the hot ticket.
--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
-------------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com.invalid>
Date: 24 Jul 2004
Subject: Re: Info. on the puppy wizard?
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 23 Nov 2003
Subject: Re: house training
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 16 Aug 2002
Subject: Re: training a dog...
works as a reminder when they "forget".
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
-------------------
But "NEVER HIT your dog", eh, matty?
From: "Nevyn" <***@badmama.com.au>
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003
Subject: Re: puppy wizzards training manual.
G'DAY STEVE.
I used to be like you.
Then I found a book...it was called... the
wits end dog training manual.... and then
there was light..and perfectly trained dogs.
--
Thankyou,
Nevyn
Nevyn E.D.
Veterinary Nurse & Animal Trainer
***@badmama.com.au
"Yu agonna get whats comin' to you...for
all the bad bad things you to do your...dog"
________________________
well i started reading your manual, Im going to
perfectly honest with you I thought last night when
i started reading your posts you were full of crap
but the more i read the more i could tell that you
really do care about dogs. That is why asked for
a copy of your manual.
I really like your analogy on barking that was very
interesting and gave it a perspective i never even thought
of. As far as your praising the dogs when they are
misbehaving i still dont understand how that works (i
didnt get all that far in the manual yet.
But i must say my female was clawing at the couch so i
praised her like you say to do, i praised her twice for
it and she stopped and came over to me.
So i think what you have to say has merit, And for one
am anxious to finish the book and get started because
i love my dogs and really am looking forward to interacting
with them on a positive note all of the time.
This may be a little premature jerry, but
Thank you
Steve
Naaah, The Amazing Puppy Wizard was just BAITING these lying
dog abusing punk thug coward mental cases again <{); ~ ) >
in her FREE COPY of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual and REPORTED
her 100% NEARLY INSTANT SUCCESS RIGHT HERE on The
Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums And SCHOOL Of HARD KNOCKS
And HUMAN And ANIMAL BEHAVIOR RESEARCH
LABORATORIES, matty <{); ~ ) >
You're settin in it <{); ~ ) >
LIKE HOWE your own DEATHLY ILL dog Rocky is DYIN from
STRESS INDUCED AUTO-IMMUNE DIS-EASE aka The Puppy
Wizard's SYNDROME, on accHOWENT of you're a lyin dog abusin
punk thug coward MENTAL CASE, matty, and you can't post here
abHOWETS nodoGgamenedMOORE <{); ~ ) >
Subject: Re: How to handle aggressive situations
Date: 2004-10-19
thinking I'm angry at him - a reason I don't "yuk out"
others' dogs at agility trials or training.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
---------------
Sometimes my "voice of god" startles human
and dog, especially when the human didn't
see the inappropriate behaviour. --Matt.
Rocky's a Dog.
only use "Chutza"(throat clearing 'ch') - "Out" when
it's reallyreally important that my dogs get away from
something.
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * ***@lppi.ucsf.edu
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 10 Jun 2003
Subject: Re: Absolutely abysmal agility day
Robin Nuttall said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior
correction so much to heart -- I'll try something
different. Right now, he's just getting the confidence
to work a few jumps ahead of me.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
"I crate Rocky, even though he's 8.5 years old, but
only when I'm gone during summertime days -
maybe an hour at the most. (Other than hot days,
my dogs are always with me.)
While Friday has been totally reliable unsupervised
from the day I got him from a rescue, Rocky has not.
Rocky will go looking for food even in areas where
there's no possibility of food.
The good thing is that he likes his crate, runs for
it when I ask, and gets food when he's in it.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAAA!!!
From: Rocky (***@sunada.com)
Subject: Re: Leg Humper
Date: 1999/09/14
up until this last paragraph.
Why did you blow it?
--Matt
incredibly abused training tool, what with the number
of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash
with both hands.
It's a good thing that most of us are here because of
dogs' well-being and not an agenda.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
=============
BWEEEEAHAHAHHAAA!!!
"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"
Koehler On Correcting The Housebreaking Backslider.
"If the punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house. An indelible impression
can sometimes be made by giving the dog a hard
spanking of long duration, then leaving him tied by
the mess he's made so you can come back at twenty
minute intervals and punish him again for the same
thing. (Dogs are REALLY stupid. J.H.)
In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment. It will be better for your dog,
as well as the house, if you really pour it on him."
"Housebreaking Problems:
"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"
Occasionally, there is a pup who seems determined to
relieve himself inside the house, regardless of how
often he has the opportunity to go outside. This dog
may require punishment. Make certain he is equipped
with a collar and piece of line so he can't avoid
correction.
When you discover a mess, move in fast, take him to
the place of his error, and hold his head close enough
so that he associates his error with the punishment.
Punish him by spanking him with a light strap or
switch. Either one is better than a folded newspaper.
It is important to your future relationship that you
do not rush at him and start swinging before you get
hold of him.
When he's been spanked, take him outside. Chances
are, if you are careful in your feeding and close
observation, you will not have to do much punishing.
Be consistent in your handling.
To have a pup almost house-broken and then force
him to commit an error by not providing an opportunity
to go outside is very unfair. Careful planning will
make your job easier.
The same general techniques of housebreaking apply
to grown dogs that are inexperienced in the house.
For the grown dog who was reliable in the house and
then backslides, the method of correction differs
somewhat. In this group of "backsliders" we have the
"revenge piddler." This dog protests being alone by
messing on the floor and often in the middle of a bed.
The first step of correction is to confine the dog
closely in a part of the house when you go away, so
that he is constantly reminded of his obligation. The
fact that he once was reliable in the house is proof
that the dog knows right from wrong, and it leaves
you no other course than to punish him sufficiently
to convince him that the satisfaction of his
wrongdoing is not worth the consequences. If the
punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house.
An indelible impression can sometimes be made
by giving the dog a hard spanking of long duration,
then leaving him tied by the mess he's made so you
can come back at twenty minute intervals and punish
him again for the same thing.
In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment.
It will be better for your dog, as well as the house,
if you really pour it on him.
---------------------
AIN'T GOT NO AGENDAS HERE, SEE?
Oh, about Michael Vick? I think we should hold him
up to pubic scrutiny for shame embarrassment and ridicule.
LIKE HOWE I JUST DONE TO THESE DOG LOVERS <{}'; ~ } >
SEE??
But what would a 800_Pound_Gorilla know about THAT?
Gorillas engaging in such despicable behaviors are BANISHED
from decent Gorilla society. Too bad humans don't have the
same high standards of unconditional love, trust and respect.
Here's The_800_Pound_Gorilla_In_The_Room's FREE training manual:
http://The_800_Pound_Room_Gorilla.cowurl.com
In Love And Light,
I Remain Respectfully, Humbly Yours,
The_800_Pound_Gorilla_In_The_Room <{}'; ~ ) >
Subject: Re: Michael Vick?Do you think he got what he deserved?
Or do you think he got off easy? lets start a debate...
HOWEDY joyorban,
"Pitbull Cruelty-Stop Animal Cruelty Please Read..."
<***@gmail.com> wrote in message news:15d94118-
af59-4bfe-8fd4-***@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
Permit me to introduce myself.
I'm The_800_Pound_Gorilla_In_The_Room <{}';~ ) >
I did *NOT* come here to ATTACK you <{}'; ~ ) >
CONtrary to pupular belief, Gorillas, are generally shy and
retiring; although I cannot speak for ALL Gorillas, we usually
prefer a veggie diet but some *(depending on their parenting)
will occasionally indulge in MEAT *(yuk!) and MOST of us
engage in frequent polygamous SEX **(Yummy~!).
I'll just gather some fresh soft leaves and make myself a nest
in the corner of your livin room here and you're welcome to
ignore me. I'll just keep quietly to myself <{}'; ~ ) >
Care for a bananna?
I just LOVE coconuts~! Don't you?
Hey?? Put two of them an WON of these banannas together
and you can PRETEND you're a Gorilla too! Hey lookey!
Squeeze this bananna an you get... hmm~!
Michael Vick? Do you think he got what he deserved?
You mean, a couple years in jail, loss of his career, reputation,fans, advertisement endorsements and millions an millions of
dollars?
What more would you PREFER to have done to him?
Would you cut his balls off like a ordinary dog lover does their own
dogs?
Google has 11,200 results for neutered in rec.pets.dogs.behavior
alone
and 397,000 for neutered in Google groups and 2,690,000 on the web.
Seems neutering is pretty well commonly accepted standard EXXXCELLENT
care and treatment of GOOD dogs <{}: ~ ( >
Wouldn't that be a REWARD?
Would you PREFER to jerk an choke him on a pronged spiked pinch
choke collar like a common dog in OBEDIENCE TRAININ?
LIKE THIS?:
"Loop the lead (it's basically a GIANT nylon or leather
choke collar) over his snarly little head, and give him a
stern correction" --Janet Boss
http://tinyurl.com/5m6ppt
-----------------
Would you PREFER to whip him with a riding crop?
LIKE THIS?:
"Pudge Was So Soft That She Could And
Would Avoid A Simple Swat On The Rump
With A Riding Crop," lying frosty dahl,
discoverer of CANNIBALISM in Labradors.
--------------------
Would you lock him in a box for 16 - 20 hours a day and
jerk an choke him on a pronged spiked pinch choke collar
and spray aversives in his eyes?
LIKE THIS?:
From: BethF (***@alaska.com)
Subject: Re: to treat or not to treat
Date: 2002-01-14
And you jerk and choke your dogs on pronged spiked pinch
choke collars lock them in boxes and call that training
and spray Binaca in their eyes to quite their crate anxiety barking...
choke collars lock them in boxes and call that training
and spray Binaca in their eyes to quite their crate anxiety barking...
too little yet for a pinch collar). They simply
wear pinch collars.
It prevents any jerking or choking on their part.
I do crate my dogs - the big one only at the dog
club and to travel, and the little one so he can
become accustomed to being in a crate.
He is learning to enjoy it and to use it as a place
to rest from the playing that he and Kavik do
.
I used binaca to quiet Kavik's in class whining
that disturbed the class. It would be quite difficult
to binaca a dog that is in a crate.
I did hit him in the eye accidentally, and stopped
using it at that time. Jerry, have you NEVER made
an error in training the dogs you have trained?
How many dogs have you trained exactly?
Can you list some references here - I
would like to contact some of your former
clients to get a reference or two?
------------------
AND LIKE THIS?:
lyinglynn writes to a new foster care giver:
For barking in the crate - leave the leash on and
pass it through the crate door. Attach a line to
it. When he barks, use the line for a correction.-
if necessary, go to a citronella bark collar," Lynn K.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"Unfortunately, some confrontation is necessary,
just to be able to handle the dogs. For example,
we need to crate train a dog immediately because
they are usually in need of medical care and they
are in foster homes with other dogs. It's a safety
necessity," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
"Training is not confrontation,"Lynn K.
<except when it is>
"So what? Whoever said that it's right to
always not confront? We sure can try, but
a dog who knows a command and growls when
given it is certainly being confrontational".
You can't simply walk away and pretend it
didn't happen or leave it for later work in
every situation." Lynn K.
-----------------------------
AND LIKE THIS?:
"Well, actually the binaca worked but after i
got him in the eye it was not a possibility to
be using that."
"Actually, the most common use of this technique
(and it is quite common) is with TABASCO sauce
either mixed with water in a spray bottle or on a rag
that you can stick in the dogs mouth instead of spraying
(after our experience I would suggest this method if I
was going to use this technique again). My dog likes
tabasco so that didnt' work for us.
Binaca was suggested as an alternative from a very
well respected dog trainer from the lower 48, however
I don't think she counted on his flailing his head in a
desperate attempt to get away from the sprayer causing
me to miss."
------------------
Would you PREFER to shock him till
you can see his neck muscles pulsing?
LIKE THIS?:
"J1Boss" <***@aol.com> wrote in message news:***@mb-m18.aol.com...
He was next to me and I could see his neck
muscles pulsing. He didn't even blink an eye.
Janet Boss
I can't imagine needing anything higher
than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive
dog like a Lab.
than a 5 with it, even with an insensitive
dog like a Lab.
I can't remember what model of Innotek I have, but
I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.
I had a pointer ignore a neck-muscle-pulsing 9.
cause the SMELL LINGERS after the dog's
been sprayed in the face and the dog won't
know HOWE COME IT was MACED?
My dogs are not human children wearing fur- they are DOGS.
I don't have anything against electronic bark collars, but they
should be used in conjunction with actually working at training
your dog(s).
I don't have anything against electronic bark collars, but they
should be used in conjunction with actually working at training
your dog(s).
DOG ABUSERS HURT INTIMIDATE and MURDER.
-----------------------
Would you PREFER to turn a Doberman loose on his stinkin arse?
LIKE THIS?:
"BethF" <***@alaska.com> wrote in message news:***@corp.supernews.com...
Maybe that's what we should do - hold back the dobie
girl so that Izzy can put Simon in his place.
--------------------
Would you STEP ON HIM like a common dog??
LIKE THIS?:
"BethF" <***@NOT-SO-bad-dawgs-in-ak.com>
wrote in message news:***@corp.supernews.com...
Kyle, FWIW, i thought it was pretty funny,
and i often call my little dog the turd, because
he is one. Some folks think its HORRRIBLE i
would insult my dog like that so i guess its just a
matter of personality.
Kyle, the best way to teach him to stay away is to
step on him once. Seriously.
--------------
Perhaps he'd think of all that as a REWARD an LOVE you for it?
LIKE THIS:
"Granted That The Dog Who Fears Retribution Will
Adore His Owner," lying "I LOVE KOEHLER" lynn.
AND LIKE THIS?:
Here's tommy sorenson of sorenson's Retriever PUPPY MILL
and SHOCK COLLAR trainin SALES aka the miserable stinkin
lyin animal murderin child an spHOWES abusin anonymHOWES
active accute chronic life long incurable mental case punk
thug coward aka not so handsome, not so gentle, not so
manly
jackass, not even jack morrison, aka joey finochiarrio aka
BIG
DADDY aka DOGMAN HEELPIN dogs:
tommy sez:
At no time do the Monks *ever* advocate beating a
dog. A swat on the rump or a check to the chin does
*not* constitute a "beating."
And then he sez:
"I don't know how big you are, kiddo, so this may
not be as easy for you as it is for me, but use
a little "knee action," that is, as the dog goes
charging by you, just give the dog a little bop
with your knee and shin. Yep, really lean into it.
Even knock her over, if you can, but make sure to
make her think twice about rushing past you again -
- which is exactly what you want her to do.
Don't bother with scolding her, she'll get the message.
If it happens again, just REPEAT the knee action.
When she steps on your toes, just pick up your foot
abruptly and nudge her with your knee. Again, no
scolding is necessary here, so you don't have to
worry about her "over-reacting."
I don't think this is necessarily a lack of respect
for you, just a lack of training. That is, she just
needs *more* of it."
You mean like HOWE when you HOWEsbreak a dog an
you beat IT with a switch or heavy man's leather belt and
tie him next to his evil deed and return to BEAT HIM every
twenty minutes, tommy?
tommy SEZ:
"My objective is always to find a way that WORKS.
And if it is DANGEROUS behavior that I'm trying
to modify, behavior than can get the dog KILLED,
I will resort to ANYTHING to save him.
A-N-Y-T-H-I-N-G.
Okay. Call me a cruel, inhumane, abusive bastard
if you want to, but it doesn't affect me at all.
When you've saved the lives of as many dogs as I
have, you'll learn that that's the only thing that
really matters. Saving lives and making dogs become
good citizens"
"Swatting a dog on the nose is always the wrong thing to do."
Or do you think he got off easy?
Perhaps we should just KILL HIM.LIKE THIS:
"I used to work the Kill Room as a volunteer in
one shelter.) But their ability to set their own
schedules and duties causes a great deal of
scheduling overhead.
And it takes effort and thought to ensure that
volunteers get the meaningful experience that
they work for.
Someone has to be responsible for that
Volunteer Program, and it is best done
by a non-volunteer."
Lynn K.
----------------
"I worked with one shelter where I bathed and groomed
every adoptable dog on intake. I frankly felt that the
effort/benefit equation was not balanced for some of the
older/ill poodle/terrier mixes we got in badly matted condition.
Should I have refused to groom them?
Or even more pertinent - I was one of the people who
had to make the euthanasia decisions at that shelter."
Lynn K.
----------------
AND LIKE THIS?:
I'll be you've never had to put down litters of
beautiful labrador puppies? If you had did, maybe
you'd be singing a different tune?
"Actually, have held them for the tech to euth, and
put their bodies in the trash bag and in the freezer
for the trash company to come and dispose of.
No different tune," ~Emily
~emily is a vivisectionist for a med research laboratory.
------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
"After Numerous Training Classes, Behavioral
Consultations, And Hundreds Of Dollars In Vet
Bills, I Killed My Dalmatian Several Years Ago
Due To Extreme Dog-Aggressiveness," mustang sally.
"I'll bet you don't know a thing about me.
I volunteered as assistant to the euthanasia
tech at our local shelter for a while, and
I know a bit about overpopulation and unwanted
animals.
This however has nothing at all to do with
responsible breeders, because responsible
breeders don't contribute to that problem,"
Mustang Sally.
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001
Subject: Re: shock collars
Sally Hennessey <***@ncweb.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
Aside from being incredibly offensive and self-
righteous, this post shows and absence of knowledge
in the differences in dogs' temperaments, or perhaps
a lack of ability to perceive same.
The fact that you, Alison, have never met a dog to
whom corrections and discomfort, even pain, were
unimportant does not mean that such dogs do not exist.
What it means is that you don't know as much about
dogs as you think you do, and you surely don't know
a damn thing about Harlan or anyone else's dog here.
I had a Dalmatian that would instigate fights with
one of her housemates; that dog had no fear or
anything, and pain incurred during a fight meant
nothing to her.
I know that that dog is not unique, and I'm sure many
people here can tell similar stories. The fact that
you, Alison, continue to say things to people such as
what you said to Theresa about causing her dog to
suffer (at least I guess that's what you meant by
"you cause your dog suffers" - - must be the King's
English you guys talk about over there) means that
you are an ignorant, arrogant, insensitive person
who is not worth further notice.
Sally Hennessey
"Sally Hennessey" <***@ncweb.com> wrote in message news:***@4ax.com...
Nope. No more than you'd convince Patch that
prongs and e-collars, in the right hands, are not
intrinsically abusive; or that dogs trained properly
with prongs or e-collars are not fearful, in pain, or
intimidated; or that any one of us here knows our
own dogs and their reactions better than someone
who has never seen them or us...hmmm.
I'm starting to see some similarities here.
Sally Hennessey
---------------
Here's janet's PARTNER:
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context,"
What I have said- repeatedly - is that he
took posts from two different people,
took posts from two different people,
took pieces of them out of context,
cobbled them together,
"Neatly," and "Smartly."
and a fake signature.
Which is exactly what he did.
The actual quote is misleading
when taken out of context,
and Jerry's faked "quote"
is downright meaningless.
Here's Jerry's version
"I Dropped The Leash, Threw My
Right Arm Over The Lab's Shoulder,
Grabbed Her Opposite Foot With My
Left Hand, Rolled Her On Her Side,
Leaned On Her, Smartly Growled Into
Her Throat And Said "GRRRR!" And
Neatly Nipped Her Ear," sinofabitch.
Here's yours:
"I dropped the leash, threw my
right arm over the Lab's shoulder,
grabbed her opposite foot with my
left hand, rolled her on her side,
leaned on her, said "GRRRR!" and
nipped her ear.
--Sara Sionnach
"The actual quote is misleading when taken out of context"
See?
lets start a debate...
O.K.~!tommy will go first:
tommy wrote:
"This, from a yellow-bellied coward who has TOTALLY refused
to engage me in debate, preferring mudslinging, hyperbole,
distortion,
lies, exaggeration, and to take Koehler completely out of context,
instead," From: ***@i1.net (Dogman) Date: 1997/11/11
Subject: Re: Koehler's Usefulness--A Concluding Assessment
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
Let's DEBATE your OBEDIENCE TRAININ, eh, tommy?
We can recommend it for use on Michael Vick <{}: ~ ) >
Ill here some inputs first,then ill let you know what i think?
O.K., I think he should go through OBEDIENCE TRAINING.LIKE THIS:
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * ***@lppi.ucsf.edu
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal sgt grant teebon, RAAF:
"Reliable Punishment Cycles, Different Thresholds
To Pain And Punishment, High Tolerance For
Correction, Escalation Of Correction To A Level
Where The Dog Yelps When You Punish Him,
Thus Making The Experience One Which The Dog
Will Want To Avoid In The Future," grant teeboon,
RAAF.
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER pal captain
arthur haggerty, USArmy K-9 Corps:
captain arthur haggerty SEZ: "A CHIN CHUCK"
Makes A ResoundingSound Distraction: "When
You Chuck The Dog The Sound Will Travel Up
The Mandible To The Ears And Give A Popping
Sound To The Dog."
lying frosty dahl writes:
"Get a stick 30- or 40-inches long. You can have a
helper wield the stick, or do it yourself. Tougher, less
tractable dogs may require you to progress to striking
them more sharply.
With your hand on the collar and ear, say, 'fetch.'
Immediately tap the dog on the hindquarters with the
stick. Repeat "fetch" and pinch the ear all the way to
the dummy.
Repeat, varying how hard you hit the dog,
Now you are ready to progress to what most
people think of as force-fetching: the ear pinch.
Make the dog's need to stop the pinching so urgent
that resisting your will fades in importance.
but will squeal, thrash around, and direct their
efforts to escaping the ear pinch
You can press the dog's ear with a shotshell
instead of your thumb;
even get a studded collar and pinch the ear against that
Say "fetch" while pressing the dummy
against its lips and pinching its ear.
if the dog still does not open its mouth,
get out the shotshell.
Try pinching the ear between the metal casing
and the collar, even the buckle on the collar.
Persist! Eventually, the dog will give in"
==============
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER PAL an janet's
REAL LIFE IN PERSON "students" paul an Muttley:
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
Hello everyone:
If you have followed some of my posts, you know
something about the ongoing story of Muttley, the
large GSD/Chow dog I have been trying to adopt
or place in a better home.
I will add a bit more history later in this post.
Last Tuesday, toward the end of Janet's obedience
class, Muttley and I had just finished fairly successfully
performing a sit/stay/come routine, and then he was
sitting by my side.
The final routine was to be a "down", which Muttley
has had some difficulty with, and frankly I have not
had the time to work with him much on that.
I was kneeling at his side, trying to hold his collar
while pushing his front legs down to the position,
while he resisted. Suddenly he lunged, knocking
me over onto the parking lot, and I lost grip of the
leash as I reflexively broke my fall.
Muttley took the opportunity to attack a young black
male Lab to my left, and it was a very brutal attack.
Janet and the instructors tried to gain control, and as
soon as I could get to my feet I grabbed the leash and
pulled him off.
That was the end of the class, and the other dog,
Bernie, was taken to an animal hospital for treatment.
When everyone had left, Janet counseled me about
what should be done about Muttley.
She said this was more than ordinary aggression,
and only intensive (and expensive) one on one
training would have any chance at working, and
in any case, he was not suited to group training.
She advised me that Muttley could be dangerous,
and she recommended that he be euthanized.
"They can't all be saved".
<snip>
--------------
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
<snip>
If I did not have to worry about my cat, I would
probably keep him, and I am certain I could avoid
any more dangerous episodes. I probably would
not have taken him to obedience classes at this time
if that was not such a difficult issue, and if people
here had not essentially shamed me into doing so.
Then he would only be a bratty dog with a mind of
his own, but he would not have been identified as
dangerous.
--------------------------
BWEEEAAAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!
Here's HOWER DOG LOVER PAL an janet's
REAL LIFE IN PERSON "student" paul:
#2 - 6/05/07
When I was training him under Janet's supervision
I was instructed to give it a ? firm yank as a correction.
I advised you to use a prong collar, not give firmI was instructed to give it a ? firm yank as a correction.
yanks on a chain choke collar. I hate the things.
She was able to get his attention with
just a quick tug, but I had to yank on it
hard enough to lift him off his feet to get
him to respond. Looking back now, I think
it was based on his fear, which he had for
her (as an unknown), but not for me
(whom he had learned to trust).
He wasn't afraid of me. He knew I was ajust a quick tug, but I had to yank on it
hard enough to lift him off his feet to get
him to respond. Looking back now, I think
it was based on his fear, which he had for
her (as an unknown), but not for me
(whom he had learned to trust).
confident trainer. Fear has no place in dog
training, as I told you THEN.
Janet
popping a choker chain, prong collar, or whatever,
is a way to ensure compliance by instilling a fear
of further punishment.
Sure, if it is administered very consistently
by a confident trainer, the dog soon learns
to obey. There was no positive reinforcement,
so what remains is negative.
Also, I recall the time you were going to show me
how I could get Muttley to take his rawhide treat
from me without lunging for it. When you offered
it to him, he refused to take it. This IMHO is likely
a fear behavior.
Things have changed a lot since then, and I have
learned a lot, and Muttley has settled down quite
a bit. I probably still give him too much freedom
to think on his own, but that's just my way of
doing things, and that's probably not going to
change much. He may never win an obedience
medal, but I don't think he is dangerously out
of control, either.
Paul and Muttley
----------------
"I thought I was told that the way to get the dog to go
down was to make him sit and then step on the leash.
That was awkward and didn't seem to work.
I will confess that I only tried the "down" position
once or twice at home, and I also often used it
instead of "Off" when I wanted him to stop
jumping on me or elsewhere I didn't want him to be.
I had to give him corrections every few seconds,
and also just about kick him, to keep him at my
left side.
Muttley is really a very sweet and loving dog, but
he needs more socialization with other dogs. However,
it is very likely that I will have him put down in a week."
Subject: Muttley: Now a question of Life or Death
"Paul E. Schoen" <***@smart.net> wrote
It is a shame that Muttley will probably be put
down (his appointment is next Wednesday),
-----------------------
THAT'S quite a SUCCESS STORY, ain't it, paulie?
BWEEEAAAHAAAHAAA~!~!~!
HERE'S HOWE COME:
Subject: Re: redirected aggression
Date: 4/11/07
"Janet Boss" <***@bestfriendsdogobedience.com> wrote in message news:janet-***@news.individual.net...
It seems I have been dealing with this a bit lately.
Dog to dog and dog to person,, with dogs who are
obviously overstimulated by what's in front of them.
What's in front of them varies from people at the door
to dogs in their path or directly in their face. The dogs
in question all have very poor self control.
I have dog(s) with not-so-great-natural self control,
so it's something we constantly work on. We don't
have redirected stuff going on, because we have enough
obedience to avoid it.
While I know that's the big answer for the dogs in
question as well, I'm curious what things people have
found useful to redirect/focus/gain attention from
drivey dogs or just very distracted of over-the-top dogs.
We're having success with my recommendations, but I'm
always open to something novel that may be the hot ticket.
--
Janet Boss
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
-------------------------
AND LIKE THIS:
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com.invalid>
Date: 24 Jul 2004
Subject: Re: Info. on the puppy wizard?
Everything he preaches is very positive, no
correction, no punishment, all praise and love.
You are very wrong.correction, no punishment, all praise and love.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 23 Nov 2003
Subject: Re: house training
I dont like the insinuations that i am abusing
my dog when i am NOT.
Then you may want to ignore the Puppy Wizard/Jerry Howe.my dog when i am NOT.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 16 Aug 2002
Subject: Re: training a dog...
The pressure meant a GOOD possibility if she could
just push up hard enough, I'd understand. I did
eventually <G>. I switched to a light tap!
Yup, once a dog learns to sit, a light tapjust push up hard enough, I'd understand. I did
eventually <G>. I switched to a light tap!
works as a reminder when they "forget".
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
-------------------
But "NEVER HIT your dog", eh, matty?
From: "Nevyn" <***@badmama.com.au>
Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003
Subject: Re: puppy wizzards training manual.
G'DAY STEVE.
I used to be like you.
Then I found a book...it was called... the
wits end dog training manual.... and then
there was light..and perfectly trained dogs.
--
Thankyou,
Nevyn
Nevyn E.D.
Veterinary Nurse & Animal Trainer
***@badmama.com.au
"Yu agonna get whats comin' to you...for
all the bad bad things you to do your...dog"
________________________
Hello, Mr. puppy wizzard, how do i find a copy of
your manual. Do you have a link that takes me to it?
I think i would like to read it.
Now i have another question for you in regards to
walking your dog. How do you feel about the gentle
leader? I bought one for each of my pups and the
difference in walking them is unbelievable. If you are
not sure what the gentle leader is check out their web
site at www.premier.com. If you are as good as you say
you are i want to read your manual.
thanks,
Steve
P.s. by the way my pup doesnt pee as soon as i put
him in his crate its after he's been in for a while
and cant hold it anymore that he pee's
Howdy, jerry,your manual. Do you have a link that takes me to it?
I think i would like to read it.
Now i have another question for you in regards to
walking your dog. How do you feel about the gentle
leader? I bought one for each of my pups and the
difference in walking them is unbelievable. If you are
not sure what the gentle leader is check out their web
site at www.premier.com. If you are as good as you say
you are i want to read your manual.
thanks,
Steve
P.s. by the way my pup doesnt pee as soon as i put
him in his crate its after he's been in for a while
and cant hold it anymore that he pee's
well i started reading your manual, Im going to
perfectly honest with you I thought last night when
i started reading your posts you were full of crap
but the more i read the more i could tell that you
really do care about dogs. That is why asked for
a copy of your manual.
I really like your analogy on barking that was very
interesting and gave it a perspective i never even thought
of. As far as your praising the dogs when they are
misbehaving i still dont understand how that works (i
didnt get all that far in the manual yet.
But i must say my female was clawing at the couch so i
praised her like you say to do, i praised her twice for
it and she stopped and came over to me.
So i think what you have to say has merit, And for one
am anxious to finish the book and get started because
i love my dogs and really am looking forward to interacting
with them on a positive note all of the time.
This may be a little premature jerry, but
Thank you
Steve
Jerry, you give the lying dog abusing punk thug coward
mental cases too much credit for the ability to influence
mental cases too much credit for the ability to influence
dog abusing punk thug coward mental cases again <{); ~ ) >
You really are a piece of work.
INDEEDY, matty. Robin studied and followed the INSTRUCTIONSin her FREE COPY of The Amazing Puppy Wizard's 100%
CONSISTENTLY NEARLY INSTANTLY SUCCESSFUL FREE
WWW Wits' End Dog Training Method Manual and REPORTED
her 100% NEARLY INSTANT SUCCESS RIGHT HERE on The
Amazing Puppy Wizard's FREE WWW Wits' End Dog Training
Method Manual Forums And SCHOOL Of HARD KNOCKS
And HUMAN And ANIMAL BEHAVIOR RESEARCH
LABORATORIES, matty <{); ~ ) >
You're settin in it <{); ~ ) >
Keep this out of the health groups, 'kay?
Dogs DIE from separation anXXXIHOWESNESS, matty, JUSTLIKE HOWE your own DEATHLY ILL dog Rocky is DYIN from
STRESS INDUCED AUTO-IMMUNE DIS-EASE aka The Puppy
Wizard's SYNDROME, on accHOWENT of you're a lyin dog abusin
punk thug coward MENTAL CASE, matty, and you can't post here
abHOWETS nodoGgamenedMOORE <{); ~ ) >
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
You've made up your mind.
But you've impressed me by mentioning
that you're a professor with 30 years of
experience.
So, can you cite some examples of
people recommending "shock collars,
hanging, and punishment"?
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
No matter what Jerry Howe states.
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BUT, giving you the benefit of the
doubt, please provide a quote (an
original quote, not from one of Jerry
Howe's heavily edited diatribes) that
shows a regular poster promoting or
using an abusive form of training.
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
So, can you cite some examples of
people recommending "shock collars,
hanging, and punishment"?
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
What's the point, but: Refer me to those posts of
which you have read so many. While you're going
through them, point out those which recommend
shocking, and pinching, and beating. Thank you.
--
-Matt. Rocky's a Dog
Thank you for your contribution.
-
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
From: Rocky (***@rocky-dog.com)--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
When you compare using sound and
praise to solve a problem with using
shock collars, hanging, and punishment
how can you criticize the use of sound?
There's nothing more to be said, then.praise to solve a problem with using
shock collars, hanging, and punishment
how can you criticize the use of sound?
You've made up your mind.
But you've impressed me by mentioning
that you're a professor with 30 years of
experience.
So, can you cite some examples of
people recommending "shock collars,
hanging, and punishment"?
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
I do know that hitting, hurting your dog
will often make the dog either aggressive
or a fear biter, neither of which we want
to do.
And neither does anyone else, Jerome.will often make the dog either aggressive
or a fear biter, neither of which we want
to do.
No matter what Jerry Howe states.
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BUT, giving you the benefit of the
doubt, please provide a quote (an
original quote, not from one of Jerry
Howe's heavily edited diatribes) that
shows a regular poster promoting or
using an abusive form of training.
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
So, can you cite some examples of
people recommending "shock collars,
hanging, and punishment"?
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
What's the point, but: Refer me to those posts of
which you have read so many. While you're going
through them, point out those which recommend
shocking, and pinching, and beating. Thank you.
--
-Matt. Rocky's a Dog
After your defense of "Limited" choking, what
would be the point? Where I come from, choking
is choking. It's never limited.
So, you can't point out abuse where none occurs.would be the point? Where I come from, choking
is choking. It's never limited.
Thank you for your contribution.
-
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
Subject: Re: How to handle aggressive situations
Date: 2004-10-19
I try really hard not to yell. The times that I have,
Solo joined in and then lunged to the end of the
leash.
Or, at the other end of the spectrum, Rocky cowers,Solo joined in and then lunged to the end of the
leash.
thinking I'm angry at him - a reason I don't "yuk out"
others' dogs at agility trials or training.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
---------------
Sometimes my "voice of god" startles human
and dog, especially when the human didn't
see the inappropriate behaviour. --Matt.
Rocky's a Dog.
Anybody else got bilingual dogs?
Long ago my Hebrew was pretty good - but now Ionly use "Chutza"(throat clearing 'ch') - "Out" when
it's reallyreally important that my dogs get away from
something.
"Well, Jack Did Hit My Dog. Actually I'd Call It A Sharp
Tap Of The Crook To The Nose. I Know Jack Wouldn't
Have Done It If He Thought Solo Couldn't Take It. I Still
Crate Him Because Otherwise I Fear He Might Eat My
Cat," Melanie Lee Chang * ***@lppi.ucsf.edu
Canine Behavioral Genetics Project
University of California, San Francisco
http://psych.ucsf.edu/K9BehavioralGenetics/
From: Rocky <***@rocky-dog.com>
Date: 10 Jun 2003
Subject: Re: Absolutely abysmal agility day
Robin Nuttall said in rec.pets.dogs.behavior
One of the things that frustrates me the most about
agility is that people seem to think that ALL dogs
are fragile, shrinking flowers who cannot be
corrected in any way.
Well, maybe one day -- when Friday doesn't takeagility is that people seem to think that ALL dogs
are fragile, shrinking flowers who cannot be
corrected in any way.
correction so much to heart -- I'll try something
different. Right now, he's just getting the confidence
to work a few jumps ahead of me.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
"I crate Rocky, even though he's 8.5 years old, but
only when I'm gone during summertime days -
maybe an hour at the most. (Other than hot days,
my dogs are always with me.)
While Friday has been totally reliable unsupervised
from the day I got him from a rescue, Rocky has not.
Rocky will go looking for food even in areas where
there's no possibility of food.
The good thing is that he likes his crate, runs for
it when I ask, and gets food when he's in it.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
BWEEEEEEEEEAAHAHAHHAAA!!!
From: Rocky (***@sunada.com)
Subject: Re: Leg Humper
Date: 1999/09/14
By "sticking your knee up," I can only presume
that you are suggesting that the people knee the
dog in the chest. If that's what you meant, just
say it, instead of beating around the bush to avoid
criticism from people like me. That kind of crap has
got to stop, and that's why I'm here, to help wean
you guys off of the abuse and into the proper methods
of dealing with behavior problems.
Jerry, I was appreciating your explanationthat you are suggesting that the people knee the
dog in the chest. If that's what you meant, just
say it, instead of beating around the bush to avoid
criticism from people like me. That kind of crap has
got to stop, and that's why I'm here, to help wean
you guys off of the abuse and into the proper methods
of dealing with behavior problems.
up until this last paragraph.
Why did you blow it?
--Matt
choke chains are outdated and barbaric in many
cases causing more harm than good.
Back at you with flat buckle collars. These are ancases causing more harm than good.
incredibly abused training tool, what with the number
of handlers I see pulling back and jerking on the leash
with both hands.
It's a good thing that most of us are here because of
dogs' well-being and not an agenda.
--
--Matt. Rocky's a Dog.
=============
BWEEEEAHAHAHHAAA!!!
"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"
Koehler On Correcting The Housebreaking Backslider.
"If the punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house. An indelible impression
can sometimes be made by giving the dog a hard
spanking of long duration, then leaving him tied by
the mess he's made so you can come back at twenty
minute intervals and punish him again for the same
thing. (Dogs are REALLY stupid. J.H.)
In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment. It will be better for your dog,
as well as the house, if you really pour it on him."
"Housebreaking Problems:
"The Koehler Method of Dog Training"
Howell Book House, 1996"
Occasionally, there is a pup who seems determined to
relieve himself inside the house, regardless of how
often he has the opportunity to go outside. This dog
may require punishment. Make certain he is equipped
with a collar and piece of line so he can't avoid
correction.
When you discover a mess, move in fast, take him to
the place of his error, and hold his head close enough
so that he associates his error with the punishment.
Punish him by spanking him with a light strap or
switch. Either one is better than a folded newspaper.
It is important to your future relationship that you
do not rush at him and start swinging before you get
hold of him.
When he's been spanked, take him outside. Chances
are, if you are careful in your feeding and close
observation, you will not have to do much punishing.
Be consistent in your handling.
To have a pup almost house-broken and then force
him to commit an error by not providing an opportunity
to go outside is very unfair. Careful planning will
make your job easier.
The same general techniques of housebreaking apply
to grown dogs that are inexperienced in the house.
For the grown dog who was reliable in the house and
then backslides, the method of correction differs
somewhat. In this group of "backsliders" we have the
"revenge piddler." This dog protests being alone by
messing on the floor and often in the middle of a bed.
The first step of correction is to confine the dog
closely in a part of the house when you go away, so
that he is constantly reminded of his obligation. The
fact that he once was reliable in the house is proof
that the dog knows right from wrong, and it leaves
you no other course than to punish him sufficiently
to convince him that the satisfaction of his
wrongdoing is not worth the consequences. If the
punishment is not severe enough, some of these
"backsliders" will think they're winning and will
continue to mess in the house.
An indelible impression can sometimes be made
by giving the dog a hard spanking of long duration,
then leaving him tied by the mess he's made so you
can come back at twenty minute intervals and punish
him again for the same thing.
In most cases, the dog that deliberately does this
disagreeable thing cannot be made reliable by the
light spanking that some owners seem to think is
adequate punishment.
It will be better for your dog, as well as the house,
if you really pour it on him.
---------------------
AIN'T GOT NO AGENDAS HERE, SEE?
Oh, about Michael Vick? I think we should hold him
up to pubic scrutiny for shame embarrassment and ridicule.
LIKE HOWE I JUST DONE TO THESE DOG LOVERS <{}'; ~ } >
SEE??
But what would a 800_Pound_Gorilla know about THAT?
Gorillas engaging in such despicable behaviors are BANISHED
from decent Gorilla society. Too bad humans don't have the
same high standards of unconditional love, trust and respect.
Here's The_800_Pound_Gorilla_In_The_Room's FREE training manual:
http://The_800_Pound_Room_Gorilla.cowurl.com
In Love And Light,
I Remain Respectfully, Humbly Yours,
The_800_Pound_Gorilla_In_The_Room <{}'; ~ ) >